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	<title>Comments on: Tick, tick, tick&#8230;.. boom.</title>
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	<description>James Hoffmann&#039;s blog.</description>
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		<title>By: Visits pt. II and moisture content. &#171; fourth wave</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98655</link>
		<dc:creator>Visits pt. II and moisture content. &#171; fourth wave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Mar 2010 04:04:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98655</guid>
		<description>[...] (as CC pointed out) our inquisitive James Hoffman posted about how old coffees still tend to taste like jute, or &#8216;baggy&#8217;, even if vac packed. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] (as CC pointed out) our inquisitive James Hoffman posted about how old coffees still tend to taste like jute, or &#8216;baggy&#8217;, even if vac packed. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: How fresh is fresh with green coffee?</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98422</link>
		<dc:creator>How fresh is fresh with green coffee?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Feb 2010 09:05:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98422</guid>
		<description>[...] a much more intelligent article on the topic of seasonality, James Hoffman is the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a much more intelligent article on the topic of seasonality, James Hoffman is the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Meadows</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98359</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Meadows</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 00:34:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98359</guid>
		<description>Geoff, that was super informative, I hope to have a beer (or maybe some coffee) with you one of these days! Maybe at SCAA? 

So on the retail level... 

If coffee is harvested between May and October, when would a roaster in the US expect on avg. to receive their coffee from origin? and how long (I understand this is subjective, so I&#039;m just asking for an opinion) should that roaster offer that particular coffee? 

I also have the same question for coffee that is harvested between November and April.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Geoff, that was super informative, I hope to have a beer (or maybe some coffee) with you one of these days! Maybe at SCAA? </p>
<p>So on the retail level&#8230; </p>
<p>If coffee is harvested between May and October, when would a roaster in the US expect on avg. to receive their coffee from origin? and how long (I understand this is subjective, so I&#8217;m just asking for an opinion) should that roaster offer that particular coffee? </p>
<p>I also have the same question for coffee that is harvested between November and April.</p>
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		<title>By: SL28ave</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98327</link>
		<dc:creator>SL28ave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2010 03:21:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98327</guid>
		<description>I think I dig it, partly because I believe Terroir&#039;s method calls for an asterisk to be placed at the end of &quot;seasonality*&quot;.

But,
If Intelligentsia tackles seasonality by grouping coffees into In Season and not In Season, which is decided by whether a coffee TASTES fresh or not so fresh... I see that as fairly well-grounded. It makes me feel secure when selecting coffees.

I notice that many consumers are still very confused about raw coffee age. They still blame hallmark agey flavors on other things such as brewing. I imagine a simple stamp will eventually help clear things up a bit.

Some talented people and some sensitized people often taste ageyness in great coffees before they even leave the country of origin. That&#039;s putting it mildly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I dig it, partly because I believe Terroir&#8217;s method calls for an asterisk to be placed at the end of &#8220;seasonality*&#8221;.</p>
<p>But,<br />
If Intelligentsia tackles seasonality by grouping coffees into In Season and not In Season, which is decided by whether a coffee TASTES fresh or not so fresh&#8230; I see that as fairly well-grounded. It makes me feel secure when selecting coffees.</p>
<p>I notice that many consumers are still very confused about raw coffee age. They still blame hallmark agey flavors on other things such as brewing. I imagine a simple stamp will eventually help clear things up a bit.</p>
<p>Some talented people and some sensitized people often taste ageyness in great coffees before they even leave the country of origin. That&#8217;s putting it mildly.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Schooley</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98325</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Schooley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2010 00:30:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98325</guid>
		<description>You know what Peter? I at one time wanted to open a roastery/produce market so that I could roast and sell coffee in the context of fresh fruit. Even then I would not have used the term &quot;seasonal&quot; in reference to coffee. I believe that you can still draw the correlations without it. I do believe that coffee fruit is seasonal, and I believe that once it has been harvested, fermented, washed, dried, rested, and hulled that it has a transient &quot;freshness&quot;. Even if we use the word &quot;seasonal&quot; without glossing over processing, we are still disregarding the importance of properly caring for green coffee once it is in our possession. The window of freshness in a coffee that has been handled properly from the word go is just not minute enough for that term to apply. I too personally believe that it is important to know when a coffee is harvested, I&#039;m in no way saying that this doesn&#039;t have an impact on a coffee. It&#039;s just that the word, a buzz word, is wrong, and frustratingly so. I have yet to hear anyone who throws the word around clearly define what these seasons are  (I&#039;m not just talking about when a coffee is harvested or the beginning of a fully processed coffee&#039;s seasonality, I mean how long is a particular coffee in season). When asked, most people say &quot;well, it depends&quot;. Which brings me back to why use one simple word for a complex process? Green coffee is different from wine and liquor (vintage and aging), which is awesome. Green coffee is different from fresh fruit and vegetables (seasonality), which is awesome. We&#039;re dealing with something pretty unique in how it is harvested, processed, handled, and prepared. Can&#039;t you dig it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know what Peter? I at one time wanted to open a roastery/produce market so that I could roast and sell coffee in the context of fresh fruit. Even then I would not have used the term &#8220;seasonal&#8221; in reference to coffee. I believe that you can still draw the correlations without it. I do believe that coffee fruit is seasonal, and I believe that once it has been harvested, fermented, washed, dried, rested, and hulled that it has a transient &#8220;freshness&#8221;. Even if we use the word &#8220;seasonal&#8221; without glossing over processing, we are still disregarding the importance of properly caring for green coffee once it is in our possession. The window of freshness in a coffee that has been handled properly from the word go is just not minute enough for that term to apply. I too personally believe that it is important to know when a coffee is harvested, I&#8217;m in no way saying that this doesn&#8217;t have an impact on a coffee. It&#8217;s just that the word, a buzz word, is wrong, and frustratingly so. I have yet to hear anyone who throws the word around clearly define what these seasons are  (I&#8217;m not just talking about when a coffee is harvested or the beginning of a fully processed coffee&#8217;s seasonality, I mean how long is a particular coffee in season). When asked, most people say &#8220;well, it depends&#8221;. Which brings me back to why use one simple word for a complex process? Green coffee is different from wine and liquor (vintage and aging), which is awesome. Green coffee is different from fresh fruit and vegetables (seasonality), which is awesome. We&#8217;re dealing with something pretty unique in how it is harvested, processed, handled, and prepared. Can&#8217;t you dig it?</p>
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		<title>By: SL28ave</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98324</link>
		<dc:creator>SL28ave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 22:51:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98324</guid>
		<description>don&#039;t take that last sentence personally... I just meant that if I want to know when a coffee is harvested, then perhaps I should offer the same to other people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>don&#8217;t take that last sentence personally&#8230; I just meant that if I want to know when a coffee is harvested, then perhaps I should offer the same to other people.</p>
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		<title>By: SL28ave</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98323</link>
		<dc:creator>SL28ave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 22:47:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98323</guid>
		<description>Chris, 
But, you do believe that coffee is seasonal, no? I see seasonality, processing, trade methods, flavor, environmental awareness, etc, all as independent when it comes to marketing. Eiss Muss Sein (It Must Be), because they are what they are. Thankfully the Intelligentsias, Terroirs and Sweet Maria&#039;s of the world do share tons of info; personally, I think the more the better.

Being a bit more experienced than the average consumer, I won&#039;t put myself in the way of torture by buying a coffee without having an idea of when it was harvested. And then there&#039;s the thing about treating others as you wish to be treated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris,<br />
But, you do believe that coffee is seasonal, no? I see seasonality, processing, trade methods, flavor, environmental awareness, etc, all as independent when it comes to marketing. Eiss Muss Sein (It Must Be), because they are what they are. Thankfully the Intelligentsias, Terroirs and Sweet Maria&#8217;s of the world do share tons of info; personally, I think the more the better.</p>
<p>Being a bit more experienced than the average consumer, I won&#8217;t put myself in the way of torture by buying a coffee without having an idea of when it was harvested. And then there&#8217;s the thing about treating others as you wish to be treated.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: SL28ave</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98322</link>
		<dc:creator>SL28ave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 22:20:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98322</guid>
		<description>Soakin up the goods here, Geoff.

There was a professional experiment that revealed that when a certain coffee was dried at too high a temperature, the cellular structure (I&#039;m guessing certain lipids, proteins and carbohydrates more than cellulose-like fibers) began to fall apart. If anyone&#039;s interested, I will go searching for the paper. I often wonder if a similar degradation would happen if the moisture gets below, say, 8.5%. Doesn&#039;t oil crack when it becomes &quot;dry&quot;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Soakin up the goods here, Geoff.</p>
<p>There was a professional experiment that revealed that when a certain coffee was dried at too high a temperature, the cellular structure (I&#8217;m guessing certain lipids, proteins and carbohydrates more than cellulose-like fibers) began to fall apart. If anyone&#8217;s interested, I will go searching for the paper. I often wonder if a similar degradation would happen if the moisture gets below, say, 8.5%. Doesn&#8217;t oil crack when it becomes &#8220;dry&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>By: geoff watts</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98313</link>
		<dc:creator>geoff watts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 11:46:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98313</guid>
		<description>Hi James!

You said:

Is it linked to processing?  Geoff Watts once told me a little theory he had, which I won’t repeat because a). I was a touch inebriated when he told me so I might get it wrong and b). It is his theory to tell, not mine and c). He may well have changed his mind.  It was, however very much linked to the results of processing before being stored in parchment.  Please Geoff, if you ever read this, correct me if I am wrong.  I know I am being a bit general there.

My feeling is that the rate at which a given coffee bean ages/decays/degrades is most probably a function of (in no particular order):
1.  The total moisture content within the seed.  I&#039;ve noticed that coffees which push up towards 12% average humidity seem to have a tendency to age more quickly than those which are closer to 10%.
There is some anecdotal evidence to support this.  I&#039;ve heard talk before from 3rd-generation farmers who claim they sometimes &#039;over-dry&#039; (to 9.5% instead of 11.5%) if the customer is willing to pay for the weight difference, and they believe this to be better for the coffee (speaking of which, there is an important economic issue here--coffee is priced by weight, in nearly every stage...the more moisture the heavier the coffee...you see what I mean).
In general I&#039;ve found Ethiopian coffees to hold up very well over time...washed Ethiopians that is ;)...as compared to other coffees I&#039;ve imported at the same time.  They tend to come in around 9.5-10%, whereas many of the other coffees we receive come in at closer to 11.5%.  So I&#039;ve begun to believe based on these types of experiences that coffees are probably more stable between 9-10 than between 10-12%.  The anecdotal evidence seems to support that. Another thing to consider when thinking about this is that most moisture readers are taking an Average humidity.  In reality it is likely true that there is a range of humidity within any lot of coffee, and that not every bean is exactly the same in moisture content. Some might be 11, some might be 13, and you&#039;ve got a reading of 12...so the higher you come towards the upper limit the more risk there is that some of the coffee is too moist.
2.  Water Activity.  Not all of the water inside the seed is equivalent.  Some is &#039;bound&#039; molecularly within the coffee, and some is &#039;free&#039;--meaning that it can migrate around through bean.  Water activity meters measure the ratio of bound water to free water, and give greater insight into what the water is actually doing inside the bean.  It makes sense that bound water (which cannot move---it is attached to other molecules) is less of a threat to cause damage within the coffee than the water that is active.  I suspect that this measurement will become more important in Specialty coffee in the future as it becomes better understood (James, you can put that on your 2o12 prediction list...)
3.  Density of the bean.  It does also make sense that beans with denser cellular structures would hold up better than those that are less dense.  When we talk about coffee aging I think that we are talking about volatile organic materials that are degrading over time and disappearing into the atmosphere.  After some passage of time there will be nearly nothing left but cellulose, which tastes starchy and bland.  Again, based on anecdotal experience I&#039;ve found beans that are especially dense do seem to hold their character a bit longer.  But this correlation is significantly weaker than the one regarding moisture content.
4.  The change in moisture/temperature that the coffee endures between the time it is dried on the tables or patios at origin and the time of arrival at the roastery.  This definitely relates to water activity.  When coffees go from places with high humidity (say, Caranavi Bolivia) to places with low humidity (how about La Paz?) and then back to an area with extremely high humidity (Arequipe, Chile) the beans are shedding and then re-absorbing moisture.  Sometimes this can happen over and over again before the coffee actually reaches its final destination.  And of course the speed of that  process is affected by temperature, where high temperatures actually exacerbate the problem. If you imagine this taking place you can see how it might wreak some havoc within the coffee seeds and probably weaken the cellular structure, making it more prone to further oxygen-related quality loss down the road.  So you can probably figure that coffees that undergo fewer changes in environment during storage/transit will probably hold up better that those that are exposed to extreme changes.  (That&#039;s a good reason, by the way, to dry mill coffee at altitude rather than down in the cities.  For example, having coffee going from a farm in Marcala, Honduras to San Pedro Sula and its high-humidity, scorching hot climate for milling is not preferable...whereas milling coffee in Addis Ababa seems pretty OK, because the city is at altitude and it never gets too hot, too cold, or too wet.
5.  Drying.  I think that coffee which is dried too quickly (say, in 4 days under direct sunlight) will tend to show signs of aging sooner than coffee which is dried slowly (8 days under partial cover).  Coffee that gets too hot (this happens oftentimes in wood-fired  mechanical driers that don&#039;t have good enough temperature control.  It also happens sometimes in places where the direct sunlight during the middle of the day heats up the coffee too much, especially when it isn&#039;t being turned regularly) will probably age faster than coffee that was dried uniformly and at a steady pace.

When you start thinking about all of these 5 things you realize that they are interrelated, and focusing on only one of them will probably not yield the correlations we want to see.  Good research would track all of these factors to best determine what is going on....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi James!</p>
<p>You said:</p>
<p>Is it linked to processing?  Geoff Watts once told me a little theory he had, which I won’t repeat because a). I was a touch inebriated when he told me so I might get it wrong and b). It is his theory to tell, not mine and c). He may well have changed his mind.  It was, however very much linked to the results of processing before being stored in parchment.  Please Geoff, if you ever read this, correct me if I am wrong.  I know I am being a bit general there.</p>
<p>My feeling is that the rate at which a given coffee bean ages/decays/degrades is most probably a function of (in no particular order):<br />
1.  The total moisture content within the seed.  I&#8217;ve noticed that coffees which push up towards 12% average humidity seem to have a tendency to age more quickly than those which are closer to 10%.<br />
There is some anecdotal evidence to support this.  I&#8217;ve heard talk before from 3rd-generation farmers who claim they sometimes &#8216;over-dry&#8217; (to 9.5% instead of 11.5%) if the customer is willing to pay for the weight difference, and they believe this to be better for the coffee (speaking of which, there is an important economic issue here&#8211;coffee is priced by weight, in nearly every stage&#8230;the more moisture the heavier the coffee&#8230;you see what I mean).<br />
In general I&#8217;ve found Ethiopian coffees to hold up very well over time&#8230;washed Ethiopians that is ;)&#8230;as compared to other coffees I&#8217;ve imported at the same time.  They tend to come in around 9.5-10%, whereas many of the other coffees we receive come in at closer to 11.5%.  So I&#8217;ve begun to believe based on these types of experiences that coffees are probably more stable between 9-10 than between 10-12%.  The anecdotal evidence seems to support that. Another thing to consider when thinking about this is that most moisture readers are taking an Average humidity.  In reality it is likely true that there is a range of humidity within any lot of coffee, and that not every bean is exactly the same in moisture content. Some might be 11, some might be 13, and you&#8217;ve got a reading of 12&#8230;so the higher you come towards the upper limit the more risk there is that some of the coffee is too moist.<br />
2.  Water Activity.  Not all of the water inside the seed is equivalent.  Some is &#8216;bound&#8217; molecularly within the coffee, and some is &#8216;free&#8217;&#8211;meaning that it can migrate around through bean.  Water activity meters measure the ratio of bound water to free water, and give greater insight into what the water is actually doing inside the bean.  It makes sense that bound water (which cannot move&#8212;it is attached to other molecules) is less of a threat to cause damage within the coffee than the water that is active.  I suspect that this measurement will become more important in Specialty coffee in the future as it becomes better understood (James, you can put that on your 2o12 prediction list&#8230;)<br />
3.  Density of the bean.  It does also make sense that beans with denser cellular structures would hold up better than those that are less dense.  When we talk about coffee aging I think that we are talking about volatile organic materials that are degrading over time and disappearing into the atmosphere.  After some passage of time there will be nearly nothing left but cellulose, which tastes starchy and bland.  Again, based on anecdotal experience I&#8217;ve found beans that are especially dense do seem to hold their character a bit longer.  But this correlation is significantly weaker than the one regarding moisture content.<br />
4.  The change in moisture/temperature that the coffee endures between the time it is dried on the tables or patios at origin and the time of arrival at the roastery.  This definitely relates to water activity.  When coffees go from places with high humidity (say, Caranavi Bolivia) to places with low humidity (how about La Paz?) and then back to an area with extremely high humidity (Arequipe, Chile) the beans are shedding and then re-absorbing moisture.  Sometimes this can happen over and over again before the coffee actually reaches its final destination.  And of course the speed of that  process is affected by temperature, where high temperatures actually exacerbate the problem. If you imagine this taking place you can see how it might wreak some havoc within the coffee seeds and probably weaken the cellular structure, making it more prone to further oxygen-related quality loss down the road.  So you can probably figure that coffees that undergo fewer changes in environment during storage/transit will probably hold up better that those that are exposed to extreme changes.  (That&#8217;s a good reason, by the way, to dry mill coffee at altitude rather than down in the cities.  For example, having coffee going from a farm in Marcala, Honduras to San Pedro Sula and its high-humidity, scorching hot climate for milling is not preferable&#8230;whereas milling coffee in Addis Ababa seems pretty OK, because the city is at altitude and it never gets too hot, too cold, or too wet.<br />
5.  Drying.  I think that coffee which is dried too quickly (say, in 4 days under direct sunlight) will tend to show signs of aging sooner than coffee which is dried slowly (8 days under partial cover).  Coffee that gets too hot (this happens oftentimes in wood-fired  mechanical driers that don&#8217;t have good enough temperature control.  It also happens sometimes in places where the direct sunlight during the middle of the day heats up the coffee too much, especially when it isn&#8217;t being turned regularly) will probably age faster than coffee that was dried uniformly and at a steady pace.</p>
<p>When you start thinking about all of these 5 things you realize that they are interrelated, and focusing on only one of them will probably not yield the correlations we want to see.  Good research would track all of these factors to best determine what is going on&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: kurt</title>
		<link>http://www.jimseven.com/2010/02/07/tick-tick-tick-boom/#comment-98311</link>
		<dc:creator>kurt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 04:55:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jimseven.com/?p=1469#comment-98311</guid>
		<description>This post rules!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This post rules!</p>
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