Comments on: A Clover quandry http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=a-clover-quandry James Hoffmann's blog. Thu, 09 Feb 2012 02:29:46 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Eric Faust http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88992 Eric Faust Fri, 04 Apr 2008 15:35:47 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88992 As I have contemplated Starbucks owning The Coffee Equipment Company, I have started to wonder if it isn’t a good thing. What I have heard a lot of, is people being dissatisfied with the Clover. That means that Starbucks has purchased something that the industry might not even want. With their purchasing of the Clover we can only hope that it will provoke someone in the industry to push even harder forward and invent something that is competitively superior to the Clover. Starbucks will either have to put money into developing the Clover or the will simply be out invented. I agree that Starbucks owning the Clover is not the greatest thing for the industry, but who is to say that it won’t lead to something greater. As I have contemplated Starbucks owning The Coffee Equipment Company, I have started to wonder if it isn’t a good thing. What I have heard a lot of, is people being dissatisfied with the Clover. That means that Starbucks has purchased something that the industry might not even want. With their purchasing of the Clover we can only hope that it will provoke someone in the industry to push even harder forward and invent something that is competitively superior to the Clover. Starbucks will either have to put money into developing the Clover or the will simply be out invented. I agree that Starbucks owning the Clover is not the greatest thing for the industry, but who is to say that it won’t lead to something greater.

]]> By: Ian Clark http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88990 Ian Clark Fri, 04 Apr 2008 15:00:14 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88990 I'd like to withdraw my earlier comments. I've now found one can achieve high yields (well, 18%) on the clover in 40 seconds using traditional doses of ~60g/l if using a very fine/"espresso" grind. I never imagined the clover could handle such a fine grind as everyone seems to hover between paper filter and above. It tastes quite nice, with little sediment. Very cool. I’d like to withdraw my earlier comments. I’ve now found one can achieve high yields (well, 18%) on the clover in 40 seconds using traditional doses of ~60g/l if using a very fine/”espresso” grind.

I never imagined the clover could handle such a fine grind as everyone seems to hover between paper filter and above.

It tastes quite nice, with little sediment. Very cool.

]]> By: AndyS http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88943 AndyS Tue, 25 Mar 2008 23:19:20 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88943 > Simply from playing around in different experiments, I haven’t been > able to get over 14.5% yield in 40 seconds even with grind settings > fine enough to leave a muddy cup. I’ve played with a wide range > of ’standard’ recipes that come nowhere close to Golden Cup. I'm very surprised to hear that. I had the same question, ran a "Clover simulation," and was easily convinced that 20% yields are possible (sorry for the long url): http://www.home-barista.com/forums/solubles-yield-as-function-of-grind-and-dwell-time-t5729.html#p68991 > Simply from playing around in different experiments, I haven’t been
> able to get over 14.5% yield in 40 seconds even with grind settings
> fine enough to leave a muddy cup. I’ve played with a wide range
> of ’standard’ recipes that come nowhere close to Golden Cup.

I’m very surprised to hear that. I had the same question, ran a “Clover simulation,” and was easily convinced that 20% yields are possible (sorry for the long url):

http://www.home-barista.com/forums/solubles-yield-as-function-of-grind-and-dwell-time-t5729.html#p68991

]]> By: Ian Clark http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88940 Ian Clark Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:20:18 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88940 I'm not saying Golden Cup is the only way to drink coffee, I'm simply pointing how that many coffee professionals have been disappointed in their clover experiences and that I suspect this is due to low yield brewing. I’m not saying Golden Cup is the only way to drink coffee, I’m simply pointing how that many coffee professionals have been disappointed in their clover experiences and that I suspect this is due to low yield brewing.

]]> By: Jonathan http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88937 Jonathan Mon, 24 Mar 2008 22:09:43 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88937 On the bright side it'll leave a few of us with a spare £6,000 or two this year...and we can all just say that we were never totally convinced anyway. On the bright side it’ll leave a few of us with a spare £6,000 or two this year…and we can all just say that we were never totally convinced anyway.

]]> By: Deaton Pigot http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88936 Deaton Pigot Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:20:47 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88936 Well its back to "just" relying on good coffee and not the marketing benifits of a machine... I am disapointed though as some folk in Oz (including myself) were really hoping this could spark some interest in the dark empty void that is the brewed coffee culture. That being said Australia really needs to get over some other obsticles directly relating to greens first. Now that the Clover buzz is over its just pushed little old Oz even further behind in developing a filter culture. I'll make myself another espresso... Well its back to “just” relying on good coffee and not the marketing benifits of a machine… I am disapointed though as some folk in Oz (including myself) were really hoping this could spark some interest in the dark empty void that is the brewed coffee culture. That being said Australia really needs to get over some other obsticles directly relating to greens first.

Now that the Clover buzz is over its just pushed little old Oz even further behind in developing a filter culture. I’ll make myself another espresso…

]]> By: Edson Ishida http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88929 Edson Ishida Mon, 24 Mar 2008 01:34:19 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88929 american way of business... no comments on that... the coffee machine is great, but their market strategy seem to forget their customers... american way of business… no comments on that…

the coffee machine is great, but their market strategy seem to forget their customers…

]]> By: JT http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88927 JT Sun, 23 Mar 2008 19:33:31 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88927 Whose to say golden cup is the only way to drink coffee? I thought the point was to push the envelope and develop new ideas and discover new taste profiles? Coffee to me is a balance of science and art. Is it always necessary to have a quantitative value? Whose to say golden cup is the only way to drink coffee? I thought the point was to push the envelope and develop new ideas and discover new taste profiles? Coffee to me is a balance of science and art. Is it always necessary to have a quantitative value?

]]> By: Ian Clark http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88924 Ian Clark Sun, 23 Mar 2008 03:27:43 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88924 Simply from playing around in different experiments, I haven't been able to get over 14.5% yield in 40 seconds even with grind settings fine enough to leave a muddy cup. I've played with a wide range of 'standard' recipes that come nowhere close to Golden Cup. Mind you, they still taste good - it's just that they lack a certain something compared to a higher yield brew. Perhaps my statement was a bit bold, but everyone does seem to follow the basic recipe of "tons of coffee in a short amount of time" for Clovers which I find invariably results in high concentrations and low yields. Simply from playing around in different experiments, I haven’t been able to get over 14.5% yield in 40 seconds even with grind settings fine enough to leave a muddy cup. I’ve played with a wide range of ‘standard’ recipes that come nowhere close to Golden Cup. Mind you, they still taste good – it’s just that they lack a certain something compared to a higher yield brew.

Perhaps my statement was a bit bold, but everyone does seem to follow the basic recipe of “tons of coffee in a short amount of time” for Clovers which I find invariably results in high concentrations and low yields.

]]> By: Clover Coffee Conclusion? - MAS o Menos http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88921 Clover Coffee Conclusion? - MAS o Menos Sat, 22 Mar 2008 21:05:49 +0000 http://www.jimseven.com/2008/03/21/a-clover-quandry/#comment-88921 [...] it appears I read some bad news today.  According to A Clover quandry on Jimseven.com, the answer is no. It seems that Starbucks has intentions of withdrawing the [...] [...] it appears I read some bad news today.  According to A Clover quandry on Jimseven.com, the answer is no. It seems that Starbucks has intentions of withdrawing the [...]

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