Comments on: Espresso, espresso, endless espresso…

By: jim

jim — Tue, 09 Oct 2007 23:09:28 +0000

Sorry not to have responded to the comments here sooner – Moscow left me disconnected for a week and I’ve been very busy since but there is lots of interesting stuff here and I will comment soon I promise!

By: Jaime

Jaime — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 06:04:40 +0000

Jim,

Regardless of origins and oughts, certain profiles such as the classic ‘blueberry’ aroma have a decided downside associated with them, don’t you think? This whole morality of the cup thing often goes a bit far past the reality of where the flavors in a cup come from. We woo the blueberry but tolerate the baggage it brings to the date… Some cups are simple novelty and others are priced on extra prep or special character. We often overlook these realities as barista and I find it to be an interesting debate for those willing to bear it or at least those simply willing to have a strong opinion one way or another.

I look forward to your review of the Coffee Collective offering.

By: nik orosi

nik orosi — Sat, 06 Oct 2007 18:42:47 +0000

finally espresso is shaking the world. hope will shake our self destruction too. thank you james for bringing this even higher, thanks to everyone, thanks to tim who actually started first with this in a galaxy fur fur away, thanks to all again. lets start live espresso trip instead of ego trip…
lets learn more and more

By: The Onocoffee

The Onocoffee — Sat, 06 Oct 2007 14:07:47 +0000

default-
Thanks for the kind words. However, I don’t know if I would categorize my positioning as “much in line with the oriental way of thought.”

Mainly because, the “oriental way” is mostly about conformity or not rocking the boat. Growing up Filipino in America, there was always the urging to do better in school, go to college, become a doctor and don’t make too many waves. Whether you’re Filipino or Chinese, Japanese, Thair or any Asian ethnicity, the societal norm is to “go with the flow” and live to the conformity of society.

Even when I lived in Hawaii and found the local culture much to my taste, there was still the tide of “don’t make A” or “no make hu hu” that promoted general conformation to island norms. My penchant for discussing that which I found “distasteful” usually resulted in me exposing my “haole-ness” of growing up in America, rather than my ethnic background.

Whether it’s just the coffee industry in general or this “Third Wave Thing Of Ours”, the perversion is that we conform: i.e. we must prefer Intellligentsia over Segafreddo – just because. That we must love Esmeralda. That Starbucks must suck at everything. To my mind, conformity leads to the erosion of our ability to grow and learn. It’s something that we must continually strive against.

I’d go into more, but right now I’m pondering the best approach towards roasting the Idido Misty Valley…

By: default espresso

default espresso — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 22:15:14 +0000

Jay, I always admire your unbiased comment and the way of thinking different than the crowd. pretty much in line with the oriental way of thought.

Rob, that’s absolutely right. Same thing happen to my Sumatra Grade 1 too.

Love this discussion. Just open up my mind a lot more.

By: Chris DeMarse

Chris DeMarse — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 20:58:34 +0000

James,
I found your article very insightful. It seems that the very nature of one who is visionary or a pioneer, so to speak, has a desire to explore the perimeters of what is common or acceptable in order to gain a higher or deeper understanding of what has defined it for so long. I appreciate your willingness to challenge the expectations of espresso as it is commonly profiled, and I hope through this that the world of espresso and those who critique it will have a broader base to work from when defining their perameters.
At the same time, I do believe in the need to respect the tradition of flavor profiling and classification because of our predecessors desire, just as your desires drive you, for a more competent understanding of quality coffee.
There is yet much to be learned for all of us as we pursue the defining glories of what many call “the third wave of coffee”. You are a pioneer.

By: rob berghmans

rob berghmans — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 18:27:34 +0000

Here in Belgium we have mostly a very hard time to trace our beans. Of course it’s nice to know more about the origin, area or estate, but i’m estonished James you never had a top quality bean with only the country name on it and nothing more.
Last week we had your winning Costa Rica from Has BEan. WE had Mountain Top, Sul De Minas, Two COE, Kopi Luwak, Kenya AA and many more. Some from Has Bean, some from Terroir and others from different high qualified roasters. But what happened : my roaster had some samples from Honduras. No name, no area, no nothing. And what happened with that espresso shot? …. it came out as one of the best, probably even the best of the bunch.
I ordered directly 20 Kg and it’s fantastic. Now i try to know where it comes from, but till now i have no results. And you know what my roaster said : “Hell Rob, you got a good coffee for a very good price. And maybe you can find another with more information, but you’ll have to pay a whole lot more”. I think he’s right and as long as the beans taste as good as this Honduras, for this price, …. let them come to daddy.
Rob
Antwerp Barista
ps : you want me to send a sample?

By: Olings

Olings — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 17:02:08 +0000

I think they were one of the first, if not the first to do it. Klaus, you’re absolutely right about the roasting profile. It’s pretty hard to nail it even when you’ve done it several times and when you know exactly how it should be done.

By: Stephen

Stephen — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:40:36 +0000

Weren’t Kontra also doing this?

By: Klaus

Klaus — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:21:50 +0000

Ola, you are so right. And furthermore there is also SO much in the roasting profile. People tend to think it’s just about the blend composition and that’s it. But if someone took the exact same percentages of for example Tim’s beans, and roasted it their way, I bet it wouldn’t taste similar at all.